I have been engaged in an overly long debate with a fellow Catholic online over Ut Unum Sint, which has been going on for over a month. I keep doubting his honesty and suspecting that he doesn't respect me, but just dismisses me as some angry "RadTrad," especially considering what said in our last exchange. I'm trying to be patient here, and just wait his response and assume he'll be answering shortly, but I just can't help but doubt him. Throughout the debate, he has repeatedly accused me of accusing Pope St. John Paul II of heresy, when my main issues with Ut Unum Sint is on a moral level, not a theological level, I'm not qualified to address the theology of Ut Unum Sint. In our last exchange he brought up more theological issues, so I asked him to clarify, and he has yet to answer. I'm going to try and wait until the end of the week or longer for his reply. Please pray that I keep my mind off of this in the meantime, and give this man every benefit of a doubt.
Pray about just what you hope to achieve by further debate. More than likely you’ll never convince him of your side, so are you just trying to influence other forum members and/or lurkers? If so, please realize that very few forum readers will stick with a thread that long. It might be time to walk away and spend the time praying for him instead.
Thanks, I will move towards shutting down this debate in our next exchange. It’s just that he keeps bringing up the implication, if not accusation that I’m accusing Pope St. John Paul II of heresy, and I want to address this before I can close the debate. I have been doing a bit better now since posting this. Thank you to all those who are praying for me.
I used to be afraid that by keeping silent and walking away I was admitting defeat. But funnily enough after a very short while it didn't seem to matter.
I've got a bit of a dilemma here, assuming he doesn't answer in the next 24 hours or so, I'm not sure whether to speak with him this Saturday, or Tuesday after the Feast of Our Lady of Lourdes. On the one hand, I want to try and finish this before the Feast of Our Lady of Lourdes so I don't have it hanging over my head on the Feast day. And on top of that, it'll be during the week where I have college and other errands to run, so I'll have limited time to deal with this guy and end this debate. On the other hand, I have been saying a Novena to Our Lady of Lourdes in which I'm asking for, among other things, intellectual humility, so I'm thinking it might be better to wait until after the Feast Day to deal with this guy and end the debate. Please lend me your prayers and advice regarding this.
Funny this reminds me of a quote I read once I think it was in proverbs it was in relation to not repeating something that someone has told you in confidence the quote was "keep it to yourself you won't burst" I think this quote can be applied to a lot of situations we're we try and resist our humanness Correction it was Sirach 19:6-12 6.Avoid idle talk, and you will avoid a lot of trouble. 7 Never repeat what you hear, and you will have no regrets. 8 Don't tell it to your friends or your enemies unless it would be sinful to keep it to yourself. 9 Whoever hears you will take note of it, and sooner or later will hate you for it. 10 Have you heard a rumor? Let it die with you. Be brave! It won't make you explode. 11 A foolish person trying to keep a secret suffers like a woman in labor.12 Any time he hears a secret, it's like an arrow stuck in his leg.
RoseryWielder sometimes your posts make me wonder if you are being genuine with all of us. If you are my apologies but some of this stuff is almost is too out there to be true. Please give link to thread. John Paul the 2 heretic. I would be interested in thread. Also, I would love another site to read. Best Regards, Br al
It wasn't a public debate, I was arguing with an old acquaintance of mine, it's a long story and I respect his privacy and so, won't give much away. It started with another conversation we had about Extra Ecclesiam nulla Salus, and he brought up Ut Unum Sint, after into it myself I discovered a lot of problems. (Most of which are above my pay grade.) So over month ago I confronted him about Ut Unum Sint and this whole thing ensued.
Just a quick clarification, he only accused me, or at the very least implied once, that I was accusing Pope St. John Paul II's Ut Unum Sint of being heretical. It was just that as the debate progressed, he repeatedly brought up again and again, that Ut Unum Sint was authoritative and that no matter what I said, I was just going to have to submit to it and go along with it. He never gave me a chance to explain to him what my concerns were, but he never accused me of accusing Pope St. John Paul II's Ut Unum Sint of heresy again after that initial accusation. It was a mistake to get into this debate, I have been trying to avoid debates altogether, but I really thought this man would listen to me. I need to do things differently, starting with overcoming my anger. If someone with a bad temper ever got angry at me, my initial response would be to immediately get angry back at them. Now I'm hoping to change that, I'm hoping that sometime in the future, if I ever come across a person who has as bad a temper as I do, I'll treat that person with mercy and compassion.
RW, if I were you, I would give internet debate a break. Maybe a very long one. If you suffer from scrupulously, engaging in back and forths can make it worse. Take better care of your soul, friend. Make serious, valiant efforts to avoid things that are going to trip you up emotionally and spiritually. Just pull the plug on certain things if you have to. Less media. More prayer.
I know, it's just, like I mentioned before else where, hard when the only people I can really talk to and trust are either in Heaven or online. But at least I have Jesus and Mary, and at least I have the Sacrament of Penance available to me, even if it's difficult to get to and the priest aren't qualified to be spiritual directors. I definitely will be taking better care of my soul, and devoting most of today to prayer and meditation, rather than the internet. Thank you very much for your support my sister.
Anytime, brother. I have noticed that my spiritual life and mental health take a nose dive when I debate stuff. Better to focus on friendly discussions, like on here, and prayer. Not saying go completely off-line; just use your on-line time wisely, and prudently.
