Well, if we're going to speculate about who is a more likely candidate to be a freemason, my money would be on the member of the European aristocracy. Freemasonry is rife among Europe's elite, many of whom are descended from once Catholic monarchs. Those European aristocrats have powerful connections everywhere, even in the Vatican. A fair and transparent investigation would exclude friends or close associates of the individuals involved. Best not to speculate at all because Pope Francis isn't averse to making confusing or conflicting statements. He is, indeed, showing himself to be quite wily. I pray that Cardinal Burke has covered his back on this.
Well, if you are referring to Cardinal Schonborn I might doubt that Satan via his Freemason minions would be acting so boldly in the promotion of the world phenomenon of Medjugorje with its fruits of vocations to the priesthood and other miracles of conversion as well as physical healings, through such a person who is drawing so many to THE Mother. That would fall into the category Christ gave us about Satan being divided and thus such a divided house would have fallen or is on its way!!
About the recent articles concerning the Malta bishops permitting civilly remarried persons to Communion....could this be a possible candidate for that "order coming out of Malta"....or be a portion of expression for this Jan. 3 alleged message to Luz de Maria? The overthrow within the Church will be taken to its most extreme point, not without first leaving strong and deep traces in Humanity, which will have to be evangelized with maturity.
Oddly enough, I wasn't thinking of Cardinal Schonborn. Your chances of Cardinal Schonborn approving Medjugorje before all the "secrets" and "apparitions" have finished vary between slim and none. And I wouldn't hold my breath on all the "secrets" being revealed before the "seers" are well and truly settled in a comfortable old age. It was you who speculated on people involved in the Malta dispute being Freemasons and gave the impression that the man who was dismissed was somehow exempt because his father was involved in a plan to assassinate Hitler. I merely pointed out that, as a member of the European aristocracy, he is just as likely (perhaps more so) to be a Freemason given that so many of Europe's aristocracy have Masonic links.
Excuse me? I think it was the article presented that reported the Pope himself ordering the cleansing of any Freemasons within said Order....no "speculation" on my part. Frankly, I was surprised about such....but not that much! And I have no clue just what is the entire background of the man who was suddenly dismissed but that articles have referenced such bravery and selflessness of his father in risking his own life it would appear for the outcome of good over evil when it came to Hitler. Often times as they say the apples themselves don't fall far from the tree! I'll wait for the examination of the process used, as ordered by the Vatican to the resistance of the "faithful" Order, before declaring anyone "exempt"....your word, not mine. Also, I never included any forward thinking about C. Schonborn "approving" Medjugorje....esp. without him being in any official position to do so. More than likely it will have its own Bishop (house already built for such behind the Church) for a direct connection to the Vatican....for whatever interim there is to be.
Here's what you said when linking to the article, and what I responded to by pointing out that being descended from European aristocracy is just as likely to be a sign of connections with Freemasonry as being the son of a hero would make a person a hero. You brought Cardinal Schonborn into the discussion. Now that you mention him, he also has links to European aristocracy, is close to the Pope, and the aristocracy have a reputation for looking out for each other. But it's best not to speculate. As to Medjugorje, I believe it to be a clever scam and that it possibly has demonic links, so I prefer not to discuss it and try to avoid threads about it. I'm just grateful that it isn't something we Catholics will ever be bound to believe in no matter how many churches are built there.
Ho hum....the reason I brought C. Schonborn into the discussion at all was in reply to your introduction of European royalty ties as likely members of Freemasonry. And so I then mentioned that he would be one example from the hierarchy who would not so likely fit that category due to his promotion of Medjugorje. Never did I say that I expected him to "approve" Medjugorje as you next alluded to since obviously he isn't in any position to do so. That was your own extension to my comment. ............Your chances of Cardinal Schonborn approving Medjugorje before all the "secrets" and "apparitions" have finished vary between slim and none. And I wouldn't hold my breath on all the "secrets" being revealed before the "seers" are well and truly settled in a comfortable old age. So then you go on to use even the mention of Medj. to give your personal point of view of Medjugorje which has really nothing to do with thread's topic. I only mentioned it as to why C. Schonborn, for one, would not be such a candidate for a Freemason based on your logic of the possibility of such connections to European royalty since he has shown a separation from the devil with such a promotion. ..........who is a more likely candidate to be a freemason, my money would be on the member of the European aristocracy. Alas, no big deal....the fact that different people within a forum happen to have differing opinions about private revelation. No sweat here. Just wish to not have my "topic limited" comments somehow be extended further than expressed. If you want to extend this further than Malta, well.....it could then become a new slant...but beyond this particular discussion for myself.
I do not know if there is serious Corruption in the Order of Malta, but I was watching this today in relation to Pizzagate and I saw this ; go to the 2.00 point and listen for about 4 minutes, at least.
Interesting. Another anniversary for 2017! From Fr. Z's Blog: http://wdtprs.com/blog/2017/01/pope-francis-freemasonry-2017/
Questions for the Archbishop of Malta January 15, 2017 by Fr. Dwight Longenecker As an ordinary parish priest it falls to me to actually deal with the cases of divorced and re-married people. I’m the person on the front line, and am therefore the one who has to deal with their questions and help them in their chosen situation. Therefore I am grateful for any guidance from above, and any bishop who offers advice on the way forward is trying to help me do my job. I have read with interest the letter from from Archbishop of Malta giving advice on how to administer the eighth chapter of the Holy Father’s Amoris Laetitia. Archbishop Scicluna’s words are kindly and pastoral and, no doubt he intends to be a good pastor to his people. Unfortunately, his letter raises in my mind another question. This is the controversial paragraph: If, as a result of the process of discernment, undertaken with “humility, discretion and love for the Church and her teaching, in a sincere search for God’s will and a desire to make a more perfect response to it” (AL 300), a separated or divorced person who is living in a new relationship manages, with an informed and enlightened conscience, to acknowledge and believe that he or she are at peace with God, he or she cannot be precluded from participating in the sacraments of Reconciliation and the Eucharist (see AL, notes 336 and 351). I am certainly all for helping the divorced and civilly re-married find their way back into communion with the church. I realize from first hand experience how complicated these situations can be and I am especially concerned for the victims of a terrible marriage–the spouse and children who are abandoned and abused. I don’t want to be “rigid” and I certainly don’t want to kick anybody out of the church because of their irregular marriage. What troubles me in the Maltese bishops’ document is that it opens the door to complete subjectivity. Rather than saying to a divorced and re-married person, “I’m afraid you are objectively outside full communion with the Catholic Church. Now what can we do about that?” It allows for an individual decision by a parish priest based on “a process of discernment, undertaken with humility, discretion and love for the Church and her teaching, in a sincere search for God’s will and a desire to make a more perfect response to it.” Yes, but in practical terms what does this mean? Father Lax takes this to mean “If you think your situation is okay with God you go ahead and receive communion.” Meanwhile Father Rigid takes it to mean, “After a long period of penance, prayer and self denial you should come to the conclusion that I have already come to, that you should come to the Eucharist, but you should not receive communion.” The more disturbing phrase is that if the person believes “that he or she are at peace with God” they cannot be precluded from participating in the sacraments of Reconciliation and Eucharist. Again, what is most concerning is the continued ambiguity. Notice that the bishop doesn’t actually say, “They may receive the Body and Blood of Christ.” He says they may “participate in the Sacraments of Eucharist and Reconciliation.” But they are already welcome to participate in these sacraments. If they are divorced and remarried they can go to confession and confess that they are in an irregular relationship and receive absolution. Then they may seek a decree of nullity and attempt to live as brother and sister until such time that their relationship can be regularized. In that sense they have always been able to go to confession. Nothing has changed. They also have always been able to participate in the Eucharist. Indeed, they are encouraged to do so. What they are not encouraged to do is to receive communion. The Bishops of Malta, in remaining ambiguous on this point, are being either naive or disingenuous. Do they mean that the divorced and re-married may receive communion or not? They may certainly participate in the Eucharist. In this sense nothing is new, but by “participate in the Eucharist” the lax will conclude that this means to receive communion whereas the rigid will conclude that it means they should come to Mass, but NOT receive communion. Consequently, the bishops of Malta, in their well meaning attempt to clarify the issue have only continued the relativistic ambiguity. Rather than clearing the waters they have only muddied it further. I don’t believe I am being particularly harsh or rigid, but simply seeking the way forward with compassion for those Catholics who are outside full communion because of this issue, to assist them and accompany them to live and walk within the teachings of the church. Here is an example from my own pastoral experience: Continue Reading
Yes, I saw this and could not help but wonder... What if this whole fight between the Knights of Malta and the Pope is because of what is on Anthony Weiner's laptop titled insurance. Not condoms.. not freemasons.. but child trafficking and child pedophilia done through the passports of the Knights of Malta. Look at the dates of Weiner's laptop revelations ( which btw are still not released by NYPD,NYSP, or FBI) and the fallout between the Pope and the knights. It around the same time minus a few days.
Is he saying that paedophiles were buying diplomatic passports from the Order of Malta? That sounds far-fetched, based on speculation with no indication that he has evidence to back it up. That's not to say that there isn't serious corruption in the Order or people abusing their diplomatic status. If there is serious corruption, Pope Francis and Cardinal Burke are probably the only people we can be sure were not involved in it. The higher echelons of the Order appear to be a who's who of Catholics with all the right connections. It's like an elite network. Finding a bus driver or carpenter numbered among them would be like looking for a needle in a haystack. And the group set up by the Pope to investigate the man's dismissal seems to be a microcosm of that kind of set-up. The Jesuit Fr. Gianfranco Ghirlanda appears to be the odd one out. A former Rector of the Pontifical Gregorian University and a canon lawyer, the head of the Jesuits sent him to sort out the Pontifical Oriental Institute which is under the care of the Jesuit order. The outcome was a kind of regime change in that Institute. The Institute was plagued with in-fighting and complaints about falling standards. The Jesuit who had been Vice-Rector until 2013 converted to Russian Orthodoxy and became a Russian Orthodox priest in 2014. A visiting Professor who also taught at the Gregorian University was found murdered in a wood near the retreat centre where he was staying. He was a priest of an order of Eastern mystics that had been founded in the 1980's by a Jesuit inspired by an Indian guru. Despite the dead priest having multiple stab wounds and choke marks on his neck, his order told the press that he had died a natural death. http://eponymousflower.blogspot.ie/2015/04/earthquake-at-pontifical-oriental.html http://chiesa.espresso.repubblica.it/articolo/1351034?eng=y&refresh_ce https://www.thetorchbc.com/2015/04/28/trouble-assails-pontifical-oriental-institute/ The rest of the team set up to investigate the Malta sacking are: Archbishop Silvano Tomasi, former permanent observer of the Holy See to the U.N. in Geneva https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silvano_Maria_Tomasi Archbishop Tomasi has connections with Marc Odendall through their work with the UN and Catholic charities. Marc Odendall is a former investment banker and one of the people appointed by Pope Francis to invesigate the Vatican's finances https://dealbook.nytimes.com/2014/0...banker-joins-vatican-financial-watchdog/?_r=0 The NYT article says that he is involved in philanthropy and serves on a number of boards but doesn't list them. I found him listed as a Treasurer for the Caritas in Veritate Foundation: http://www.fciv.org/activities In 2012, when then Bishop Tomasi, Papal Nuncio, decorated him with an honour from the Order of St. Gregory, he credited Mr. Odendall with working to set up and finance Veritate in Caritas of which Bishop Tomasi was the President https://www.cath.ch/newsf/un-genevois-decore-par-le-saint-siege/ Jacques de Liedekerke https://www.orderofmalta.int/2002/0...d-chancellor-of-the-sovereign-order-of-malta/ A lawyer and Belgian nobility, he is a former Pro-Grand Chancellor of the Order and has been a member of the Government Council of the Order. He founded an international law firm in Belgium which appears to be this one, although I can't find anything to confirm that: http://www.liedekerke.com/ Marwan Sehnaoui. I couldn't find any background on him. Here's a video of him talking about the Order's work in Malta. His wife is an artist: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mouna_Bassili_Sehnaoui and one of his sons, Khalil, is something of an expert in IT security, especially hacking. Born in Lebanon, Khalil grew up living between Paris and Beirut. Despite no mention of any connections to Belgium, he has dual Lebanese/Belgian nationality which suggests that one of his parents is Belgian, yet his mother is Lebanese. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khalil_Sehnaoui The Lebanese branch of the Order was set up in the 1980's by the Order's then ambassador to Lebanon and his wife. An investment banker living in New York, he was a prince of Bohemian Czech/German royal lineage. The two main protagonists in the current dispute also have some pedigree: Albrecht Freiherr von Boeselager is the man who was dismissed. https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albrecht_Freiherr_von_Boeselager He's a lawyer and comes from German nobility - his grandfather was a Baron and his mother a Countess. I gather from his Wiki page that his wife is a German Countess. His family were anti-fascist and his father, an officer in the Wehrmacht, was involved in a few failed plots to assassinate Hitler, including the Valkyrie plot. Fra’ Matthew Festing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_Festing is the Grand Master who sacked von Boeselager. Only the third Englishman to serve in the role, he has been Grand Master since 2008. A graduate in Modern History at Cambridge, he is the son of a Field Marshall and Chief of the Imperial Staff of the British Army. Festing's father converted to Catholicism and became a Knight of Malta after his conversion. On his mother's side, he is descended from an ancient English recusant family (English Catholic nobility who refused to attend Anglican services) and numbers among his ancestors Blessed Sir Adrian Fortescue (a courtier at the court of Henry VIII and relative of Ann Boleyn) who was beheaded in the Tower of London in 1539.
Fra' Matthew was admitted to the Sovereign Military Order of Malta in 1977. In 1991, he took perpetual vows, becoming a Knight of Justice. From 1993 to 2008 he served as Grand Prior of England, the first in this office since 1815. I think it's just easy to get passports in Malta.....just "pay to play". It's just sorta overlooked since it appears to be just a little ceremonial place; no threat. Malta slammed for cash-for-passport program The super-rich are using the option to buy access to the EU and beyond. Malta has issued hundreds of passports to non-EU nationals in exchange for huge sums of cash over the last two years, resurrecting concern that the country is effectively selling access to the European Union. The passports were granted to wealthy individuals who made large donations to the government and dropped cash to buy property on the Mediterranean islands without being required to live there. Prime Minister Joseph Muscat’s spokesman Kurt Farrugia said almost 700 passports have been issued to non-EU nationals since the program’s launch in 2014. Those passports have so far generated at least €200 million for Malta. Farrugia was responding to questions from POLITICO after the government released a list of more than 900 people granted Maltese citizenship last year. Critics charge that the program undermines the concept of European citizenship, potentially poses security risks and provides a possible backdoor for Russians seeking to escape sanctions against their own country. ......... “We have no idea about the names or who the hell they are,” said Jason Azzopardi, the country’s shadow justice minister. “There’s no way of knowing.” ...... “This is a very privileged offering for the world elite,” Major said, adding that the program builds “a connection with the top 1 percent of the world population.” .......... “It’s a very powerful passport in terms of mobility.” http://www.politico.eu/article/malta-cash-for-passports-program-individual-investor-programme/
That report is about passports issued by the Maltese government. Other European countries, including Ireland, have similar arrangements whereby very wealthy people can gain (buy) citizenship by investing large sums of money or setting up businesses that give employment. I'm pretty sure that has nothing to do with diplomatic passports issued by the Order of Malta.
I thought people were referring to the video as some kind of connection to the topic of the Order of Malta which I was attempting to explain that the concern of the video seemed to be outlined by the report re: how easy it is to get passports in Malta. I don't know where that extends to the Order of Malta as yet since that is yet to be exposed....or is there another report or video about that separately? Where is the investigation about that in particular? Until that evidence is spelled out then it's just a question of...."what if". Perhaps just another Church affiliated swamp to drain? Hopefully C. Burke is man enough to carry out that mission....and perhaps "discover" the deeper "qualities" hidden inside the external "dress" and accoutrements.
I only watched the video from the 2.oo point that Lumena recommended. The man was talking about passport issuing authorities, especially diplomatic passports and at about 4.30 on the video there's a kind of post-it label note with this: "the Knights of Malta Can Issue Diplomatic Passport - Giustra Enterprise Partners?" The Knights can't issue any kind of passports on behalf of the Maltese Government, which was the topic covered in the report you linked to. Passports issued to people who invest in European countries are ordinary passports. As far as I know, diplomatic passports are only issued to people travelling on Government business, such as ambassadors. I don't know much about the Order of Malta, but I imagine that their Diplomatic passports would be issued to Knights travelling on diplomatic missions on behalf of the Order. Since the order doesn't have an actual country, people in possession of their diplomatic passports would also have their own national passports.
So what's the point? Because it's easy to get passports in general in Malta no one is paying any attention to the little Order issuing its own type of passports either? And it is to be assumed that the Order is issuing ways to easily break international law and go unnoticed because they are "Knights"? Now that's chutzpah. But then today it seems that nothing should surprise. What does the Pope understand about what constitutes fertile ground for "birthing" and hiding in plain sight, Freemasons?
I don't know. I think the problem with the Malta State's system wasn't that there is such a system in place. Rather, the problem is that the price was too low. Very wealthy people don't quibble over a few hundred thousand dollars here or there. I have been to Malta. I remember seeing a harbour in or near Valetta that was packed with luxury yachts. I don't know what kind of security there is for the super rich travelling by yacht but I would hazard a guess that it wouldn't be very difficult to smuggle people if they wanted to, although it would be very risky. There are much poorer countries than Malta where it would be easier and even cheaper to bribe an official to get your hands on a passport.
